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Road Traction Engineers' Discussion.

20th February 1908
Page 25
Page 25, 20th February 1908 — Road Traction Engineers' Discussion.
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Which of the following most accurately describes the problem?

Assembled for the first time this session at its old quarters at the Hotel Cecil, this society held a very successful meeting in., connection with the paper read by Mr. Howard Humphreys. The paper, as will be noticed from the report already published, deals with the whole subject in a most comprehensive manner, both from the point of view of the road user and the road maker, and, although the discussion was prolonged until a comparatively late hour, and was taken part in by many wellknown authorities, it was not possible to exhaust the many points of interest suggested by such a paper. Sir J. H. A. Macdonald, K.C.B., and Col. Crompton represented one point of view ; Mr. Gladwell arid Mr. Manning put the case on behalf of the road surveyor; and Mr. H. Percy Boulnois endeavoured to steer a middle course as the representative of the Local Government Board in this matter. Others who added their experience were Mr. Douglas Mackenzie, whilst Mr. Charles and Mr. Eames represented the legal, and Major Paul the military interests. The discussion reached a high level, and the general opinion was that this was one of the most interesting meetings that the society has as yet had. In the unavoidable absence of Mr, George Pollard, M.I.Mech.E., Dr. Shaw, as an Honorary Member, occupied the chair, and his management of the meeting contributed in no small measure to the excellent character of the debate.

Importance of Road Reform.

Sir JOHN -MACDONALD, in opening the debate, said he was quite certain that the prosperity of the country was bound up with the commercial use of highways. No doubt the roads could only be put into proper condition at very great expense; the reason for this was the mismanagement in the past, but the position had to be faced. It could not be too much impressed upon the public generally that the whole of the community was interested in the road question, for, if good roads existed, it would materially increase -the wealth of the country, and be an advantage to everyone. Undoubtedly something was being done towards making more use of our main roads than iit the past. The Secretary of the Post Office had reminded him, a few days ago, of the great development which was taking place in the direction of carrying the mails long distances by road, and a recent innovation in this respect was a meter mail service between London and Dover. If anybody had suggested, 15 years ago, that such a thing could happen, he would have been regarded as a visionary. No doubt railways had done a great deal to facilitate long-distance traffic, but for short distances both for passengers and goods—motor services on roads offered the prospect of being able to deliver passengers or parcels at the exact place where they were required instead of at a railway station some miles from the real destination. He was of opinion that, had the development of motor traffic been foreseen, many branch lines of railway would not have been constructed, and certainly it was not likely that many light railways would be constructed in the future in view of the greater advantages offered by motor transport. The tendency of railways had been to kill small places and to develop large towns, but with motor transport he believed that many of these small places might again become prosperous. It was not true to say that motor traffic created dust. The dust was the result of the method of road making Which had been adopted. He might, perhaps, refer to a piece of road laid near Clapham Common with tarmac. He had seen that road after it had been laid down 6 months, 13 months and 2 years, and he could see no trace of wear in it, and the road remained quite dry and other roads in the neighbourhood were covered with wet. He had taken the trouble to ascertain the views of residents in the neighbourhood with regard to that road, but all except one had replied to the effect that it was the best in the district.

The Influence of Wheel Diameter.

Col. R. E. CROMPTON said his interest in the road question had been largely stimulated by the author of this paper, and he had himself initiated discussions on the subject at the Institution of Civil Engineers and elsewhere. His contention had been that the road was just as much a part of a motor vehicle system as the rail on which a locomotive ran was a part of a railway system, and, therefore, with the growth of motor transport, the road problem became of increasing importance. We lived in an age where it was necessary that the road engineer and the motor engineer should co-operate in the settlement of this great problem. Observations had shown that certain classes of traffic damaged the road more than other classes, and it had been found that a good deal depended upon the road foundation. A bad foundation caused a movement in the centre of the road towards the side ; this might be noticed on the Regent's Park Road, which joined the North Road proper at the Tally Ho corner, Finchley. In that section of road the footpath had been forced into the most extraordinary form owing to the very heavy traffic of small

wheel vehicles on the top of the road which had had the effect of squeezing the foundations and lifting the footpath. He was of opinion that that was largely due to the use of motor wagons carrying heavy weights on wheels of small diameter and in that respect reform must come from the motor engineer. He noted that the Middlesex County Council intended to deal with about 12 miles of the Great North Road. He was glad to bear testimony to the excellent work which had been done by Mr. Gladwell and Mr. Manning who had shown that roads could be put into good order to meet modern traffic conditions at a reasonable expenditure of money. With this improvement in the road and by taking means to increase the diameter of the wheels of motor vehicles and distributing the weight over a sufficient number of axles, there was no doubt that road reform could be accomplished at comparatively small expense. Some road engineers had produced roads in some respects superior to the tarmac referred to by Sir John Macdonald. So long as it was necessary to spend 4s. to 4s. 6d. per square yard, it was natural that the movement for the reform and improvement of roads should be slow, but now that the cost had been reduced to within a few pence of the ordinary cost of making a road, he hoped that progress would be much more rapid. Road engineers were learning the proper way to make a road, and there was every prospect that the few miles of road now laid down would be increased to very many hundreds of miles in a very short time, and that the whole of the main roads of the kingdom would be made fit to meet modern traffic conditions within the next few years. It only needed the co-operation of motor engineers and road engineers, the results of which had already made themselves apparent, to carry out this great reform.

Question of State Aid.

Mr. BOULNOTS said that he had come to the meeting to learn, on behalf of the Local Government Board, what were the latest opinions on this important subject. Undoubtedly the foundation was an important part of the road, but it would appear from the results of Mr. GladwelPs experiment that the foundation was not so important as they had formerly imagined, and indeed Col. Crompton had on a former occasion expressed his opinion that roads could be put down on the ordinary surface of the ground in new countries to carry the necessary traffic. The difficulty iii this country was how to obtain a suitable surface for all classes of traffic. With regard to recent legislation, be would like to say a word as to the pollution of streams, action having been taken against local authorities on that ground. It was clear that tar macadam, whilst it might get rid of dust in the neighbourhood of streams, led to the possibility of river pollution, and a case had been brought against a tramway company for the use of creosoted wood which had injured the trees in a nursery garden. The suggestion was made that the State should make a grant in connection with road improvements, but, while he agreed that something should be done for the general benefit of the community in regard to roads, the matter must be approached in a guarded manner. The modern tendency was undoubtedly to expect aid from the State in respect to all sorts of reforms. He would draw attention to the fact that a very important State Congress was to take place in Paris this year on the subject of roads, and delegates were being invited from all countries. He thought that the interchange of views at such a congress might be productive of much good. He quite agreed with the author of the paper on the subject of bridges, and where a bridge was found either by the Board of Trade or the Local Government Board to be in a dangerous condition, the owners should be compelled or induced to put that bridge into a condition to carry the traffic which the road itself would bear, and some legislation designed to meet that point would be of great value.


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